Help with settings for 144hz monitor

[Nuggs]

I picked up a freesync (gsync compatible) Dell monitor earlier this year and I love it, but while TFC looks and feels silky smooth the major drawback is I can no longer hit any shots when sniping

I have v sync disabled, g sync enabled for hL.exe thru nvidia control panel, refresh rate is set at 144hz and fps_max is 125.5 fps.

If I set fps_max to 144.5 to match the monitor refresh rate I start to have trouble with HH nade jumps. If I disable v sync and g sync I get awful tearing but can snipe fine, but movement is janky

I know the gold src engine is a fickle mistress and I'm sure I'm missing something obvious, but any help or input is appreciated

[Paft]

Semi-useless comment:

I have no fix to share but perhaps some things are worth a try.

I got a 240Hz XG258Q (G-Sync compatible on an Nvidia GPU) in May last year. I too found that without G-Sync/V-sync TFC looks and feels like turd. Tearing mess.

I haven't noticed anything glaringly different sniping or shooting wise, but I'm not particularly good these days anyway.

If you're on an Nvidia GPU I use the following 3D settings for hl.exe:
Low Latency Mode: ON
Monitor Tech: G-Sync Compatible
Power Management: Prefer Maximum Performance
Preferred Refresh Rate: Highest Available
Vertical Sync: On

TFC:
fps_override "1"
fps_max "236.5"
gl_vsync "0"

I disable Fullscreen optimizations--Save this as a .reg or see attachments:
Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00


[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\System\GameConfigStore]

"GameDVR_FSEBehaviorMode"=dword:00000002

"GameDVR_HonorUserFSEBehaviorMode"=dword:00000001

"GameDVR_FSEBehavior"=dword:00000002

"GameDVR_DXGIHonorFSEWindowsCompatible"=dword:00000001

And I check the boxes in MSI tool:
https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/windows-line-based-vs-message-signaled-based-interrupts-msi-tool.378044/

Make a restore point or backup beforehand.

Since Goldsrc isn't popular anymore there's little mention of it adaptive sync wise. But maybe try posting at https://forums.blurbusters.com

I remember Spoofer having issues on a G-Sync display. Stutter mainly.

[Nuggs]

Thanks for the tips Paft I'll try those settings.

That's a pretty sweet monitor you have there. I've been floored with the 144hz + gsync technology and was kicking myself for not picking one up earlier. The exact model of mine is Dell D2719HGF

I'm running a 1050ti which is still chugging along nicely with my ancient i5 4660k and 16GB ram.

I'll try and hit up spoofer on discord as well since he doesn't seem to have any issues sniping.

[Paft]

Yeah, good luck. It's a big dunno form me.

Nice, enjoy.

[ I got it used as the prices we're/are rediculous for a 1080p display. I actually wasn't overly impressed for the price (I don't know where they come up with these prices-- new tech = BS $$$ I suppose.) I think it's because the early 240Hz models had drawbacks such as poor overdrive which I mentioned here if you care: https://forums.blurbusters.com/viewtopic.php?t=5415

Asus to launch 360Hz 1920 x 1080 IPS (The Asus ROG Swift PG259QN) gaming monitor next month for $699 (£629).   
At least it's IPS.

I was previously on a VG248QE 144Hz and the jump to 240Hz feels/looks much much smaller than it sounds. ]

I recall Spoofer saying he had to return it. But maybe he has new information to share.

[Spoofer]

Coincidentally, I had been trying to find people to talk to about G-Sync performance again recently, and Paft joined OST today while I was aliasing and I asked him about how his G-Sync (-compatible) was fairing for my own curiosity, lol, and he mentioned your problem.

And yeah, I went through 2 different brands of 240hz 1080p G-Syncs (Asus and Dell, though they both use the same panel IIRC), and I could never resolve the stuttering issue.  The stuttering was so bad, it would lock TFC up long enough to freeze commands in place.  TFC was the only game I had that problem with.  So I returned both (they had other unrelated problems as well), and I'm still longing for an upgrade over my old 144hz (as the tearing can be obnoxios, especially in a high-motion game like TFC).

I never had any problems sniping on them though.  Quite the opposite, it improved my performance a bit (inbetween the stutter lockups).

The only thing I thought of when discussing it in OST before I read your post, was if you were setting your FPS above the monitor's refresh rate with G-Sync/V-Sync on, which would deactivate G-Sync and switch over to V, which would introduce a decent amount of input lag.

But that doesn't seem to be the case, so I don't have an answer either.  =x

[Bishop]

G-Sync is only needed when your monitor refresh rate is faster than your selected game fps - G-sync lowers/matches your monitor refresh rate to match your fps to eliminate screen tearing and stuttering.   If you decide to run your fps lower than your monitor then g-sync should be good. I wouldn't do this except perhaps if you have a 240 hz monitor for the reasons explained below. 

FPS is one of the most important settings in half life; how fast you can choose your fps is limited by computer hardware (CPU and/or GPU).  Ironically fps has less to do with your actual frames per second since the visual differences are small compared to other important effects of fps in Gold Source games.  The Gold Source Half Life engine uses your fps in a way that effects (in a small but noticeable way) how many bullets you can fire/second, how much air acceleration you get from strafing, how much damage you take, how high you jump, and others.  Some values are better than others depending on what you are looking to do; 125 is good but there are better ones. 

I suggest you experiment a bit, higher isn't always better and small changes can have a big effect on game play.  It is therefore important that your computer hardware can achieve a consistent fps because the small changes/drops in fps have such a large impact to performance.  Then pick your fps based on what you find performs best and can be consistently achieved (not considering visual effects) - then only use g-sync if fps < monitor refresh rate. 

V-sync locks your fps to your monitor refresh rate; this will eliminate screen tearing but should not be used due to the negative consequences of having an fps at the monitors refresh rates - which are not good choices for fps in Gold Source.

[pizzahut]

G-Sync is only needed when your monitor refresh rate is faster than your selected game fps - G-sync lowers/matches your monitor refresh rate to match your fps to eliminate screen tearing and stuttering.

With my crappy old 60Hz monitor I always have input lag if v-sync is on, and it's gone when v-sync is off. (The system can handle more than 100 fps.) So I was thinking with VRR (the general term for FreeSync and G-Sync) you can avoid input lag and tearing instead of having to choose between the two.

[Bishop]

VRR dynamically adjusts your monitor refresh to match your fps.  VRR/G-sync doesn't do anything if fps > max monitor refresh...since the monitor can't  keep up.

[Paft]

Sure, but as we mentioned for whatever reason TFC looks atrocious on our displays without G-Sync. My old non-adaptive sync 144Hz isn't like that.

And in the worst-case scenario, my FPS dips to 150ish. https://steamcommunity.com/app/20/discussions/0/1643168364668035386/

I've been drinking and shouldn't be posting-- but here I am...

In my understanding with using G-Sync (from last year)---
-cap your FPS 3 or so FPS below your max Hz. Ideally with an engine cvar. The next alternative would be via Riva tuna. Driver control panel options cause the most input lag.
-Disable in-game V-Sync
-Enable GPU driver control panel V-Sync

This should result in the least amount of input lag on a 240Hz. 2-3ms  at most. Which in my books I doubt it perceivable.

However, I'll need to re-read this with a clear head to refresh my memory: https://blurbusters.com/gsync/gsync101-input-lag-tests-and-settings/14/

[I stopped playing TFC for a little while when I got the display. And that's what I used for modern games. When I returned I applied the same logic. Right or wrong for TFC I'm not 100% sure, but it's been ok enough for me overall. But I don't have much choice. And as mentioned Goldsrc is really weird with FPS over 100 or so. So...                   

I remember 119.5 or 120FPS being ideal at one point. No idea if that still applies today. The dev(s) keep tinkering with stuff. I believe they fixed the increased fire-rate issues for the most part  "recently". Most noticeably the trick with low FPS people used to use as HWguy.

The only really noticeable issue with my frame-rate is often sticking walls/ramps but I've learned to deal with it. Little choice. It's that or ungodly tearing and a chugging feeling.]

[Spoofer]

Per my own testing FPS no longer impacts firing rate in TFC to any significant degree (it did up until a few years ago), and IIRC the only commonly-occurring difference FPS makes with damage is for fall damage, which is negligible (1-2 points typically) compared to HLSP or CS where the difference would be more pronounced.  I tested a bit and never noticed any difference in jumping, either (though I think I noticed some in HL itself? don't recall).  It does still impact speed gains and what not, so the higher the better, up until the point you start sticking on ramps (~200ish, though you can get away with it up to at least 288 if you're careful on them).

In my experience with my BenQ 144hz XL2411Z, you still want to set your FPS to a specific value based on your monitor refresh rate, specifically to an even multiple of the refresh rate if you don't have VRR.  I didn't do this for the first x years I had this 144hz monitor and I never perceived there to be anything wrong, but once I realized the mismatch was causing judder and switched to an even multiple, it felt like a brand new monitor since it was so much smoother, and from then on I'd always notice the judder whenever I'd deviate from even multiples.  So for TFC I play at 144, 288, or 432 FPS for the smoothest experience, with the higher the FPS the less I notice the tearing.  Unfortunately on full ADL maps I can rarely maintain a consistent 288+, so I have to settle for 144.  The tearing is still really bad at 144 FPS, especially for a game like TFC with constant motion, which as I said before is why I wanted the GSync.  VSync's input lag on my system/monitor is significant, and there's no way I'd ever have that enabled.

GSync definitely gave the best of all worlds.  I could set my FPS to whatever I wanted below 237ish without worrying about multiples, there's no judder since there's no FPS/refresh rate mismatch, there's no tearing, and the input lag is imperceptible.  If it wasn't causing TFC (and only TFC) to stutter and lock up randomly dozens of times per match, it would've been perfect.  I still don't know what caused that, and the problem disappeared whenever I disabled GSync.  I suppose something in my own personal hardware chain is the cause since Paft and Nuggs don't seem to have any problems (with stuttering) on their G-Compatibles.  I'd still love to hear from someone who has actual GSync how theirs runs, but usually retro gamers don't buy $500+ monitors to play old games.  :{

The tearing was a lot less noticeable at 240hz/FPS even with GSync off, but I'd still love a VRR monitor for modern games where I can't maintain that many frames.

[Nuggs]

So I did lots of unscientific testing this weekend with the various suggestions here and the final result was surprising. The best result actually came from disabling gsync and using gl_vsync 1

First I went into nvidia control panel and changed "monitor technology" from gsync compatible to "fixed refresh" and vsync to application controlled

Then I changed gl_vsync to 1 and fps_max to 144.5

With vsync on and gsync off, fps matched to refresh I have a very smooth experience, minimal tearing. I can snipe perfectly and movement feels a little floaty but fine. HH jumps are OK, the only issue I'm having is I'm tending to get stick on ramps or walls more often

If I lower FPS to anything below 144.5 then the jankiness and stuttering is noticeable but set right at 144.5 with vsync on looks and feels great

So thanks for the tips everyone. After all that it seems gold src doesn't like gsync but plays well with vsync \ (- -) / :devilsidesmile:o

[Nuggs]

V-sync locks your fps to your monitor refresh rate; this will eliminate screen tearing but should not be used due to the negative consequences of having an fps at the monitors refresh rates - which are not good choices for fps in Gold Source.

Bishop can you expand on this, why it's not a good idea to use vsync locked to refresh rate? Because doing exactly that solved most my problems except sticking to ramps and walls more often

[Spoofer]

With the old monitor, were you playing with VSync on?  Because with VSync on, you're playing with what would (most likely) be pretty significant input lag.  If you got used to pre-aiming/leading while sniping with VSync on with the old monitor, it'd make sense that for it to feel "right" on the new, you'd also want it on.  But you'd probably be better off sticking within the GSync range (FPS set to 3~5 below your refresh rate) and getting used to what sniping feels like without the input lag from VSync, as ultimately it would make you far more responsive.

[Nuggs]

Been messing around with more settings

I turned off vsync, enabled g sync, locked fps to 99.5 and it seems pretty decent shot registry and movement wise, but the picture is still janky and not smooth. It's really buzzard how the gold src engine works as literally every over game looks butter smooth

So even with input lag I think I'll stick with 144.5 fps and vsync as it's the best balance visual and gameplay wise, thought still not perfect

And not to complain but TFC looks and played best on my 22" CRT with 85hz locked to 85fps and vsync on. But that was a decade ago 😁

[JakeLeCat]

Sup Nuggs,

I recently changed from an old benq 120hz monitor to a 144 ultrawide.. Had similar issues to start with. 200/250 fps looked fine before without any kind of sync but look jank as hell on the new one. I think it's because i changed from a tn panel to VA which has a slower pixel update.

I found the best bet was either gsync on and capped to 125fps or double+ the refresh rate (288). I found everything looked butter smooth with gsync on but felt the latency increase compared to a higher value.

Are you also adjusting your cmdrate to 5 above the fps cap?