While I own quite a few games, I probably only play TFC on a regular. So my question is would upgrading to a gaming mouse make a difference in my aim/accuracy in TFC?
I currently use a cheap ass dynex mouse that I probably got for like $15 several years ago.
Logitech Trackman ball mouse is the only thing worth using, imo.
:idea:
I use a logitech G500 - couple of them actually. anyway, it feels good in my hand, its a gamers mouse too...older model tho
Imho, an super good gaming mouse is not much more useful than a regular gaming mouse.
Heck I even used the default Dell mice that came with older PCs back during the golden age of TFC. The only reason I switched to a gaming mouse is because they usually have more buttons (5+ instead of default 3).
Skill over equipment any day of the week.
If you havent already, try messing around with mouse acceleration via the steam startup. You'll get better results tweaking settings than spending money on fancy mice.
I have no problems with my mouse now. I'm just curious if it makes a difference. If there's a chance I could benefit from an upgrade, it's something I would consider doing.
If you have no problems with your mouse now, I don't see why you would change. My current mouse has been in use since 2004. Old tech, but still great. It's small but fits 5 buttons. The only reason I'd choose another is if this one broke or there were other small, cheap mice with 7+ buttons.
Some people will tell you that they get better results with expensive mice. I have a strong feeling it is placebo effect. I've wasted so much money buying new mice, thinking I'd be a much better player. All it did was thin my wallet.
too many factors to determine, unless you can TELL your mouse isnt as accurate as it could be (see mouse dpi) there really is no need to upgrade.
personally, I cannot live without my gaming mouse, its a logitech mx518 (discontinued, replaced by the g400s) and it has a good amount of buttons, adjustable dpi settings and overall it has a nice feel to it, unless you have extra money to throw at a good mouse that'll last you 5-10 years, chances are there's no need to get a new one.
on a more serious note: I would never go to a discussion forum for advice on pc parts, whether it be internal hardware or input devices, id go to wikipedia, learn the differences and figure out what would work best for my needs (99% of the time the $10 mouse from walmart will get the job done ;))
Good question p0izon. First of all, there are a number of settings that are more important to get right than having a game vs non-gaming mouse. Most important, make sure you do not run with any mouse acceleration, as this makes it impossible to develop muscle memory (the same amount of movement results in different aiming depending on whether you move the mouse slow or fast). For windows users make sure you have disabled 'Enhanced Pointer Precision' and select the middle choice (6th tic) on the pointer speed. Then in game adjust your 'sensitivity' so that it is comfortable. Apparently Windows does some funny things with mouse input and even these settings may not completely remove all acceleration. There are a number of sites (search, remove mouse acceleration in windows) that will provide registry entries to get exact 1-1 movement.
It is also important that you have you tfc rate settings correct. While not related to mouse performance, having bad settings here will cause more problems with your aiming than any mouse. If you want me to go over those, message me sometime or make another post.
Now back to your question on a gaming mouse. I played for years with, and swore by, regular MS mice (the kind with the ball) and I wore out bunches of them. Finally I broke down and bought a Logitech G9, but was skeptical that it would make much difference. Surprisingly I loved it immediately and it made a noticeable difference. It is hard to describe how much better it feels, but I suspect the people (I was one of them) that say a gaming mouse doesn't matter, are players who have never used one.
One of the big differences between a gaming mouse and non-gaming is that non-gaming mice report mouse inputs around 100/sec...gaming mice report ~10x as many. Another important feature is that gaming mice have ~10 higher dpi. Plus I think the G9 has a super nice feel to it (two different grips to choose from), 5 buttons, and customizable weight. While it is true that most of these differences are small, they apparently add up to a significant difference in your play.
Furthermore, while I paid ~$100 for the G9, it has lasted many years and surely saved me money. I have literally a dozen MS carcasses in my garage (~$20 a piece)...before I switched to the G9 I had become quite proficient and combining the good bits of broken mice to make a new workable one. Now I have a reliable mouse that is 10x better. I strongly suggest you do a little research and pick a gaming mouse that fits your style (different types are good depending on how you hold your mouse, e.g. do you move just your fingers or your whole hand). Once you find a good fit, I think you will be very happy with the results.
I move my hand with my wrist resting on my desk.
The only time this mouse fails me is when sniping (which is why I never snipe). I can't be precise with my aim. I would assume that is a DPI issue, because I have the same problem in Photoshop when trying to make precise cuts. Feels square-like, rather than smooth circle-like if that makes any sense.
Quote from: Master on June 11, 2014, 12:54:57 AM
on a more serious note: I would never go to a discussion forum for advice on pc parts, whether it be internal hardware or input devices, id go to wikipedia, learn the differences and figure out what would work best for my needs (99% of the time the $10 mouse from walmart will get the job done ;))
True, but I wanted to get a perspective from gamers. This is more research than anything. I get by just fine with the mouse I have now.
3 reasons why i like my mouse - high dpi, feels good in my hand, lots of buttons.
what do you use ps for? you into photography too?
Mostly web/graphic design. I can do Photography, but I'm not heavy into it.
(https://scontent-a-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xaf1/t1.0-9/388573_10200563926130895_621543257_n.jpg)
I did this event last year in NYC that was pretty fun. It was a new experience for me photography wise. I usually only do portrait work.
nice. ive never done anything like that.
I hate doing portraits, hate dealing with lighting, and well - people.
I shoot mostly scenery and since i work at the local airport i shoot planes and helicopters. Ive also gone back to film shooting b&w. mostly digital but when i want to have some fun I will bring one of my 100 or so film cameras. I also develop my own film.
Poizon, you sound like you have your mind made up on getting a new mouse. If I were you, I'd just get one, try it out and return it if you don't feel it is worth it.
Quote from: Saleen219 on June 11, 2014, 01:40:00 PM
nice. ive never done anything like that.
I hate doing portraits, hate dealing with lighting, and well - people.
I shoot mostly scenery and since i work at the local airport i shoot planes and helicopters. Ive also gone back to film shooting b&w. mostly digital but when i want to have some fun I will bring one of my 100 or so film cameras. I also develop my own film.
I hate it too. I don't do it professionally. Mostly only do it for family and friends whenever they need it. You develop your own film? That's neat. I've never messed with film before.
Quote from: pig on June 11, 2014, 05:07:33 PM
Poizon, you sound like you have your mind made up on getting a new mouse. If I were you, I'd just get one, try it out and return it if you don't feel it is worth it.
The only thing that's certain is that I will ultimately need a new mouse for work. Now whether I should shell out extra money for a gaming mouse has not been decided. Judging by the replies, I'll probably be fine with what I have now or any small upgrade I make for work.
Quote from: p0izon on June 12, 2014, 08:26:51 AM. Judging by the replies, I'll probably be fine with what I have now or any small upgrade I make for work.
You should do what you think is best, however all replies save one, have suggested that a gaming mouse is worth the investment.
logitech is the best bang for your buck... I use a g300. My mouse is so old I cant hold down mouse 1 anymore... so I stopped playing sniper and hw.
Well a gaming mouse should have good dpi, right? Well, in your photoshop work this might be of a help as well as in gaming.
p0, I have been using a mouse to work with design programs like photoshop, dreamweaver, shockwave, and microsoft expressions...I was complaining to a friend about the lack of precision with my "fancy" at the time microsoft ergo 5 button mouse. He pointed me to a "Razor" mouse for $70 that changed EVERYTHING precision wise. These guys are focusing on the gaming aspect while I can tell you from personal experience it does help for gaming but it doesnt make you better just easier for you to be as good as you already are. In design however it changes the game.
My razor died after a couple years and I was not thrilled so I changed brands to a Logitech g500 pro - weighted gaming mouse. With the weights you can control the way the mouse feels in your hand ..I made it heavy so if I am working on a fine detail design it doesnt overshoot the area I am trying to fill or color.
I paid $149 for it when it came out because it felt perfect. I found you an awesome deal..the seller has 10+ left at $35 each, if you buy it and hate it and cant return it I will buy it from you so you wont be out any money. I believe its that good. Mine is still going strong but I just bought one myself.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/300941241201?lpid=82
P.s. I have had mine since 2005 and its still awesome. See pics. Third pic is the weights, that is what is in the little metal case in the Ebay pic.
Ya i have the g500, just not the pro version but you can still wiegh it down
Logitech all the way!
BUT, it HAS to be a Trackman/trackball mouse! Geez, get a new one and convert to just having your thumb do the walking! We can have Trackman group meetings and everything!
;)
Quote from: SpamDaddy! on June 14, 2014, 10:15:44 AM
p0, I have been using a mouse to work with design programs like photoshop, dreamweaver, shockwave, and microsoft expressions...I was complaining to a friend about the lack of precision with my "fancy" at the time microsoft ergo 5 button mouse. He pointed me to a "Razor" mouse for $70 that changed EVERYTHING precision wise. These guys are focusing on the gaming aspect while I can tell you from personal experience it does help for gaming but it doesnt make you better just easier for you to be as good as you already are. In design however it changes the game.
My razor died after a couple years and I was not thrilled so I changed brands to a Logitech g500 pro - weighted gaming mouse. With the weights you can control the way the mouse feels in your hand ..I made it heavy so if I am working on a fine detail design it doesnt overshoot the area I am trying to fill or color.
I paid $149 for it when it came out because it felt perfect. I found you an awesome deal..the seller has 10+ left at $35 each, if you buy it and hate it and cant return it I will buy it from you so you wont be out any money. I believe its that good. Mine is still going strong but I just bought one myself.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/300941241201?lpid=82
P.s. I have had mine since 2005 and its still awesome. See pics. Third pic is the weights, that is what is in the little metal case in the Ebay pic.
moral of the story: don't buy overpriced "gaming" hardware from a company that only advertises via paying off pro gamers, their hardware is good, but it's not durable and it's only targeted to those who want to be like the 1% of gamers that get their money by streaming (super disposable income, free advertising for them )
The top name brands (pretty sure logitech is king in this territory) should be good for the gamers who aren't "working" in the esports industry
Quote from: SpamDaddy! on June 14, 2014, 10:15:44 AM
p0, I have been using a mouse to work with design programs like photoshop, dreamweaver, shockwave, and microsoft expressions...I was complaining to a friend about the lack of precision with my "fancy" at the time microsoft ergo 5 button mouse. He pointed me to a "Razor" mouse for $70 that changed EVERYTHING precision wise. These guys are focusing on the gaming aspect while I can tell you from personal experience it does help for gaming but it doesnt make you better just easier for you to be as good as you already are. In design however it changes the game.
My razor died after a couple years and I was not thrilled so I changed brands to a Logitech g500 pro - weighted gaming mouse. With the weights you can control the way the mouse feels in your hand ..I made it heavy so if I am working on a fine detail design it doesnt overshoot the area I am trying to fill or color.
I paid $149 for it when it came out because it felt perfect. I found you an awesome deal..the seller has 10+ left at $35 each, if you buy it and hate it and cant return it I will buy it from you so you wont be out any money. I believe its that good. Mine is still going strong but I just bought one myself.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/300941241201?lpid=82
P.s. I have had mine since 2005 and its still awesome. See pics. Third pic is the weights, that is what is in the little metal case in the Ebay pic.
Can I click the mwheel down with that mouse?
not sure about the razor, or with the G500 PRO. but you can with the G500
Quote from: p0izon on June 14, 2014, 09:10:09 PM
Can I click the mwheel down with that mouse?
there are mice that exist where the mousewheel is not an additional 'button'? the companies that make such devices need to be wiped off the face of the earth, this is the only way I open links any more (new tab) and close tabs.
Quote from: p0izon on June 14, 2014, 09:10:09 PM
Quote from: SpamDaddy! on June 14, 2014, 10:15:44 AM
p0, I have been using a mouse to work with design programs like photoshop, dreamweaver, shockwave, and microsoft expressions...I was complaining to a friend about the lack of precision with my "fancy" at the time microsoft ergo 5 button mouse. He pointed me to a "Razor" mouse for $70 that changed EVERYTHING precision wise. These guys are focusing on the gaming aspect while I can tell you from personal experience it does help for gaming but it doesnt make you better just easier for you to be as good as you already are. In design however it changes the game.
My razor died after a couple years and I was not thrilled so I changed brands to a Logitech g500 pro - weighted gaming mouse. With the weights you can control the way the mouse feels in your hand ..I made it heavy so if I am working on a fine detail design it doesnt overshoot the area I am trying to fill or color.
I paid $149 for it when it came out because it felt perfect. I found you an awesome deal..the seller has 10+ left at $35 each, if you buy it and hate it and cant return it I will buy it from you so you wont be out any money. I believe its that good. Mine is still going strong but I just bought one myself.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/300941241201?lpid=82
P.s. I have had mine since 2005 and its still awesome. See pics. Third pic is the weights, that is what is in the little metal case in the Ebay pic.
Can I click the mwheel down with that mouse?
Yes sir, you can.
Quote from: Master on June 15, 2014, 12:42:38 AM
Quote from: p0izon on June 14, 2014, 09:10:09 PM
Can I click the mwheel down with that mouse?
there are mice that exist where the mousewheel is not an additional 'button'? the companies that make such devices need to be wiped off the face of the earth, this is the only way I open links any more (new tab) and close tabs.
Yeah same here. I had to start checking because on some reviews for a few mice that I had bookmarked said that you couldn't click it.
Quote from: SpamDaddy! on June 15, 2014, 04:29:02 AM
Quote from: p0izon on June 14, 2014, 09:10:09 PM
Quote from: SpamDaddy! on June 14, 2014, 10:15:44 AM
p0, I have been using a mouse to work with design programs like photoshop, dreamweaver, shockwave, and microsoft expressions...I was complaining to a friend about the lack of precision with my "fancy" at the time microsoft ergo 5 button mouse. He pointed me to a "Razor" mouse for $70 that changed EVERYTHING precision wise. These guys are focusing on the gaming aspect while I can tell you from personal experience it does help for gaming but it doesnt make you better just easier for you to be as good as you already are. In design however it changes the game.
My razor died after a couple years and I was not thrilled so I changed brands to a Logitech g500 pro - weighted gaming mouse. With the weights you can control the way the mouse feels in your hand ..I made it heavy so if I am working on a fine detail design it doesnt overshoot the area I am trying to fill or color.
I paid $149 for it when it came out because it felt perfect. I found you an awesome deal..the seller has 10+ left at $35 each, if you buy it and hate it and cant return it I will buy it from you so you wont be out any money. I believe its that good. Mine is still going strong but I just bought one myself.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/like/300941241201?lpid=82
P.s. I have had mine since 2005 and its still awesome. See pics. Third pic is the weights, that is what is in the little metal case in the Ebay pic.
Can I click the mwheel down with that mouse?
Yes sir, you can.
Looks like I'll definitely be going for a Logitech then.
I am sure you won't regret it, p0!
i finally agree with something Spammy says :P
ya, you wont regret it. ive ben using logitechs for *years*
Quote from: Saleen219 on June 16, 2014, 07:36:32 PM
i finally agree with something Spammy says :P
ya, you wont regret it. ive ben using logitechs for *years*
Meh. :blink:
Cmon its funny !
:p
I use a Logitech G9 lazer mouse....they work great,look for online deals
Just ordered the g500. Should be getting it Friday.
BAM! 8)
Yer gonna love it!
It actually came a day early. This thing is legit. I played around inside Photoshop for a few mins and the movement is sooo much smoother. The center scroll toggle is awesome too.
For TFC I had my NeoTF class binds on my mouse, so gotta get used to all the buttons being on the left side. I can shotty people so much easier now though.
Quote from: p0izon on August 01, 2014, 12:41:22 AM
It actually came a day early. This thing is legit. I played around inside Photoshop for a few mins and the movement is sooo much smoother. The center scroll toggle is awesome too.
For TFC I had my NeoTF class binds on my mouse, so gotta get used to all the buttons being on the left side. I can shotty people so much easier now though.
I knew you'd love it, did you enjoy being able to set the weight to an exact feel?
I threw in all the 4.5g and my hand was tired as shit after a few hours because I tend to lift the mouse and reposition it quite often. I had to switch them out some. I think I got the perfect balance now. But yes, the weights are really helpful.
I can honestly say its my most fav mouse that ive every used. Got a couple of em.
I only have 1 wt in it, works fine for me.
Quote from: p0izon on August 01, 2014, 05:19:33 PM
I threw in all the 4.5g and my hand was tired as shit after a few hours because I tend to lift the mouse and reposition it quite often. I had to switch them out some. I think I got the perfect balance now. But yes, the weights are really helpful.
lol I did that at first as well..once you fine tune it to the application it's a dream for design work.
I don't know why many people buy stuff just for games, for example new Video Cards for better performance, Gaming Mouses, Joysticks, New Monitors, for me it's just an huge waste of money. When I get a computer I never change the components, even if they are bad for gaming!
You buy computers? Now thats a waste of money. Build your own, and build it to your needs.
I'd like to build my own computer but then every component for it would be too expensive, buying the whole unit is cheaper.
Quote from: Elitesse on August 15, 2014, 07:19:07 AM
I don't know why many people buy stuff just for games, for example new Video Cards for better performance, Gaming Mouses, Joysticks, New Monitors, for me it's just an huge waste of money. When I get a computer I never change the components, even if they are bad for gaming!
I recently upgraded my video card and can run almost all my games now on high settings. Didn't even spend more than $100. That's including the mouse.
Compare that to buying a brand new computer... I'm pretty sure I saved money rather than wasted.
I bought a new computer, four years old, capable of running many games too, for 20 $ on eBay. It was sold that cheap because the previous user didn't know how to fix a simple problem on it. I saved lots of money too.
Quote from: p0izon on August 15, 2014, 04:21:37 PM
Quote from: Elitesse on August 15, 2014, 07:19:07 AM
I don't know why many people buy stuff just for games, for example new Video Cards for better performance, Gaming Mouses, Joysticks, New Monitors, for me it's just an huge waste of money. When I get a computer I never change the components, even if they are bad for gaming!
I recently upgraded my video card and can run almost all my games now on high settings. Didn't even spend more than $100. That's including the mouse.
Compare that to buying a brand new computer... I'm pretty sure I saved money rather than wasted.
Must have been a Linux Graphics card: Those things run great!
Eli seems to contradict themselves on many posts. Trollometer pointer is tending to positive.
Well yes its true its cheaper to buy a store built computer, they are built with cheap parts that will not stay current at all, out of date before you get it home.
You build your own computer you can get GOOD parts, and build it to suit your needs, not tey to get a comouter thst might be good enough for your needs.
If you build it, you can fix it if a part blows.
My new computer cost me $2500 or so, saved about 3-5 hundred by getting things on sale. But this computer was over built, WILL do what i need it to do, and will do so for years to come. The old computer i did the same, over built it. It replaced a 6 year o,d or there abouts computer that i again over built. Its still going strong but i replaced with the 3 year old computer because its just better than the older one.
Ya i smell some bs too :p
I *STILL* don't understand why you all won't go to a Trackman ball mouse. No need to move your hand/wrist/forearm around.
No mousepad worries, and they work great for notebooks while browsing on the couch!
(This post is mostly kidding. I have used a trackman for, I guess, decades now, probably never going to change unless they never sell them.)
Building my own computer is almost impossible, I use Laptops and because of this I can't modify them. I hate Desktop Computers, they are too heavy and not portable at all. Also I contradict myself on many posts because I don't pay attention to the things I'm writing in my posts.
Yu csn build your own laptops too
I don't think so. When I go to the shops, I can only see Pre-Made Laptops and Desktop Computers. I heard that in a few shops I can ask a worker to make my own Desktop Computers but I never head something like that about a Laptop because it's simply impossible. Laptops are always premade by the Company that makes them.
Negative, if you know where to look, you csn find the cases. You can build your own laptops. Yes its,harder to do so but it can, and has been, done.
Its difficult to find the white cases but they are out there
Interesting, I have never seen something like that. Here in Italy I never saw a shop where I can build my own Laptop, and I have visited lots of shops in lots of cities!
I built a PC for just a little under 1200 dollars back a lot of years ago (7 I think) and I can STILL play most releases today on high settings, but it is time to upgrade, I am probably just going to get a new video card for the time being, but overall it was much cheaper than buying a PC from some store that uses the cheapest parts they can find and mass produces computers, I want a PC to do things a console cannot, I don't want to see how cheap a computer can be, I want to see how long I can get a PC to last me, no need to upgrade it every 3 to 5 years, its cheaper just upgrading parts.
This is so ironic, you are all speaking about high-end computers and stuff like that while I still use a 14 yrs old computer that should be placed in a museum!
Exactly master. A good vid card upgrade would make it feel like a new computer
Quote from: Saleen219 on August 16, 2014, 08:17:22 PM
Exactly master. A good vid card upgrade would make it feel like a new computer
Yeah, but I should probably upgrade my pentium 2 processor soon.
Quote from: Master on August 16, 2014, 11:59:00 PM
Quote from: Saleen219 on August 16, 2014, 08:17:22 PM
Exactly master. A good vid card upgrade would make it feel like a new computer
Yeah, but I should probably upgrade my pentium 2 processor soon.
lol
I just upgraded my OptiPlex 760. I got it for 25 bucks at a flea Market - The guy said "It wont put out no pitcher..my buddy that knows about this stuff said that it ain't got any plugs for a TV screen...20 bucks and yuou can have it..I give'at for it a while back..back before I knew I got f****d..." It looked brand new but someone had taken the PCIe card out of the slot. Took it home, threw an old Nvidia PCIe card in and she's been running ever since! Just added Win 7 64 bit and 4 more gigs of ram, a 2gb Nvidia GFX 650 card, and a 650 watt power supply for $187 a couple months back. Still kickin' butt! Total investment $207.00
sheesh, my regular priced grafx card was around the $750 mark lol
All this custom build talk got my nips nice and perky. I ended up ordering a bunch of parts yesterday. I just couldn't find a keyboard. Any recommendations? I wanted to go with a Logitech, but they all looked horrible.
Edit: I went with this one. It was too sexy to pass up.
http://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard-4-professional/
Uber ;)
Quote from: p0izon on August 19, 2014, 09:24:33 AM
All this custom build talk got my nips nice and perky. I ended up ordering a bunch of parts yesterday. I just couldn't find a keyboard. Any recommendations? I wanted to go with a Logitech, but they all looked horrible.
Edit: I went with this one. It was too sexy to pass up.
http://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard-4-professional/
I use Logitech K520 it is wireless and uses 2 AA batt. but I have yet the need to replace them. I have had this keyboard about 1.5 years now.
also thought id mention that im using a old pc as well with win 7 and a agp slot.
Put the computer together and it didn't boot. Couldn't figure out why. Put my old computer back together and now that shit doesn't work. Lol. Fml.
Quote from: p0izon on August 21, 2014, 09:50:38 PM
Put the computer together and it didn't boot. Couldn't figure out why. Put my old computer back together and now that shit doesn't work. Lol. Fml.
Two words. Power Supply. :P
Quote from: SpamDaddy! on August 22, 2014, 12:42:52 AM
Quote from: p0izon on August 21, 2014, 09:50:38 PM
Put the computer together and it didn't boot. Couldn't figure out why. Put my old computer back together and now that shit doesn't work. Lol. Fml.
Two words. Power Supply. :P
You think? I made a little progress on it. The PSU only had a 4-pin connector. My MB has an 8-pin , but the PSU came with a 4-pin to 8-pin adapter. I initially had that on and when I took off the adapter and only used the 4-pin connector on the 8-pin slot on my MB it actually booted, but I wasn't getting any video. Either with the on board video or my GFX card.
Could that still be the PSU?
Good call, went to Best Buy and bought a better PSU and sure enough, the PC booted just fine.
Don't judge me =[, this was my first PC build. I'm quite satisfied though. Besides that little PSU trouble, everything else was a cinch to install. It was annoying having to figure out the best way to route wires and tie them down though. I did draw blood removing the 24-pin connector of the old PSU from my motherboard. Pulled my finger nail a tad bit off my skin. Ouch.
You need to trim those suckers, sometimes, Po!
Those newer larger vid cards take a lot more power too, my new ones required extra power cables hooked up to the card itself
Glad you found the issue :)